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Post by manape on Jun 8, 2007 15:45:34 GMT -4
People can have anything they want. The trouble is that they don't know what they want. The person who knows what they want knows what they must become, and they then fix their attention on the preparation of them self toward that end. by Earl Nightingale www.nightingale.com/tae_Article_Print~A~IsYourDestinationClear~i~142.aspHave you read "The Secret" or some other book that inspired you to do something? Or maybe you just have a talent for getting things done, tell us about your experiences here. Maybe your goal is just to live the simple life. How are our simplifying your life?
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Post by summerose on Jun 8, 2007 19:14:20 GMT -4
Yes my destination is clear. I plan on living a good, christian life and hopefully going to Heaven when I die.
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Post by shortcircuit on Jun 8, 2007 20:21:43 GMT -4
I plan on seeing heaven also summerose! Even though I have sinned and fell short of his glory.
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Post by karmaxtrodinair on Jun 9, 2007 1:50:25 GMT -4
I will agree with all of you.. however, some people learn more about what their journey will be as they go through life.. finding what does work by finding out what does not work.. The best part of the journey, is knowing where you are heading.. and tho we may fall, stumble.. its the getting back up and seeing clearly, that our life is not as hard as we sometimes make it for ourselves.. or let others make it for us. I will admit that Ive been wrong.. sought too much in vain in my life rather than with an open heart.. I am not bragging about that either. Ive often been hungry and thirsty and seen others cups full and wondered why them? Why the ones who do not make their own drink, drink from another's cup.. why must they feast on the chicken leg, while the workers eat of oats.. and do you know what a good friend told me.. the response was just as good as any other response I had read or heard pertaining.. that the oats were healthy. I got that message.. Anything that I have sought after without vain reason, has been much greater riches than the ones I have sought in vain.. The Purpose Driven Life is an awesome book.. but while I cant say that it was just one book.. that has enriched my life, its been a multitude of Gods graces for teaching.. Shortcircuit, I am guilty of sin as well.. and Ive fallen short of his glory.. many times. I was raised like many others whom I know in Blairsville.. that if God ain't in it, I can not win with it! Its held to be true. At least for me. I do not wonder about those feasting on the chicken anymore.. because they have their own journey that they are on. I've also learned the catchy phrase, "If it works for you!" Taking that phrase, not only in one certain area with my life but all has also helped me. Ive learned that sometimes, the needy does not want helped. Ive learned that just saying no to my kids and husband instead of saying yes to something that I really feel is not worth the risk in my heart is better than watching the risk manifest itself.. Theres personal growth around us.. but I havent found as much by being idle than I have with the ambition to seek what is lacking in life in general.. Seek and you will find. Much peace and love to each for their personal journeys.. because we each have more to offer than we know!
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manape
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Post by manape on Jun 11, 2007 7:57:42 GMT -4
I'm putting another book on my list to read. The title is "Using Integrity to Succeed." I heard about the book on GMA. One example of using trust and integrity in the book was about a man who has a hot dog stand in New York. He put change out so customers could make their own change. It enabled him to do other things in his business so he could serve his customers better. According to the book, trust begets trust. It is like saying I trust you and it is all about the "How" we conduct our daily lives.
I took a course in customer service through a job club group I was involved in for a while. The video we saw was about giving the customers the pickle. I know that may be a strange title, but it was about giving customers something extra like a free pickle at a restaurant.
Applying the pickle to our daily lives, goes a long way building trust and integrity. Having a destination in mind like heaven is a good thing, but it is the journey that is important. Grace is free and I think we should give it away every day like the pickle. The way we apply the pickle principle is to apply integrity and trust in our dealings with people. I believe we can give it away and we will get more in return.
I enjoy adding levity to the political forum, but I do hope people can see Jesus in me. I just don't take myself too seriously. Also, I don't take other people so seriously. We are all on the journey and I believe we should have fun in life.
What are some of your rules to live by? Do you use the pickle in your daily dealings with other people? I gotta go give 'em' the pickle.
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Post by karmaxtrodinair on Jun 11, 2007 8:58:08 GMT -4
Manape, I gotta admit.. thats something to really think about.. your pickle theory and the wiener theory. Trust.. Ive always thought of this as its given.. until someone proves otherwise. Daily routines change for the most part. How we live changes too. For some its a leveled off with no higher or lower expectations. For some its a roller coaster of ups and downs. I admire the person who has a level life with no decreases.. however, its not always in how one lives their own life I do not believe as I have seen the most Christian of people, the most trust worthy of all I know and the best examples I would have ever wanted to follow myself, come to battle destinations that had nothing to do with themselves in general but what was laid in front of them. Trust used to be a handshake and smile.. and a done deal that both came out happy with. Now it takes even more than that. Do we trust that because one person has made one wrong that their wrongs are all that they know? Ive seen people marry the wrong person.. and trust got them there.. all to find out that they were wrong. Have you? Does this mean that trust or expectation is the key here? Seen many who put trust in words of wisdom, to see that the wisdom of one didn't suit the logic of another's disposition. Trust is good when you have a relationship with someone... be it personal or business. Personal; The rules I personally live by is trust is pretty much given unless I learn that I can not. Ive been told one sided stories many of times for another to manipulate their own logic and used it as a vice to estimate their sincereness.. only to hear the rest of the story by learning the other side of the story to find that I over estimated what I thought was logic, truth and sincereness.. I guess this could be considered a damned thing in some ways, however, its easier to learn the lesson rather than keep repeating them. More than likely, its a case of another not wanting to accept their own weaknesses. Golly, the truth hurts.lol! Would I trust someone who told me a sad story.. yeah, I would.. someones sadness is a depth of their pain. I trust that. Would I trust someone who makes mistakes and will lay the blame on others, probably once.. maybe twice.. but after the third time, I know to look at the FULL PICTURE. Hey, I don't like making mistakes either but I do. Theres fine lines between Trust, manipulation, and dishonest I believe some intentions are pure while others aren't. Life does not always seem to go as according to plan.. so take the bitter with the sweet, do your best, see it through and LEARN FROM OUR MISTAKES. Not everything is evil or the devil.. I do believe our weaknesses are wanting improvement! God wants us to improve. We weren't none born without a cause in this life! Business, I will be the first to say that business depends on another person.. that generally depends on another. If you or I woke up and didn't have someone that we were depending on to need what we offer, or have to offer.. than we would have no business. Retailers depend on wholesalers to supply, customers depend on the retailers. it is a domino effect and time, and life have proving that there can be rewards to this trust and there can be devastation too.. The USA has seen days of feast and famine. People who have forgotten that book keeping began on paper and depend on the computer programs and back up modes ... need I say more? Even computers screw up. Nothing is full proof on this earth. Way of life with trust for me is different than I suppose another persons. Intentions.. what are your intentions and expectations and how will the outcome be? Would you hurt yourself/ would you hurt yourself? Manape, I do not hold someones past over their head. I have a past too. Ive had to learn my own lessons and I can only hope that others can learn theirs. They wont as long as they can put their own bad off on another.. and another.. There are some good hearted folks.. but I don't think that the good hearted folks keep letting people run their lives in the wrong direction.. they too or we too usually LEARN OUR LESSONS.. so the rules we come to live by, should be set by the lessons learned along with God in them. Trust is a big thing.. can we trust one day to be the same exact of thing we see tomorrow? I trust that Gods love is with us.. and thank God that he is a forgiving God, FOR ALL OF US. Integrity is a good thing to have. .. I agree..
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manape
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Post by manape on Jun 11, 2007 10:16:55 GMT -4
Second cup of coffee ramblings.
You have good words to live by, Karmax. Sometimes you have to balance trust in relationships. God gave us a brain to know when to trust and when not to trust. It is hard for some to use their brains, but we can learn to be better at through out the journey.
The ups and downs are normal to an extent. The key to ups and downs (mistakes and circumstances) is learning from them. One premise of the "Secret" is we attract the conditions that surround our lives by our very thoughts. Positive thoughts will attract the conditions that make our live better and negativity will attract the conditions that don't enrich our lives or cause us pain.
In the spiritual sense, there is a lot to be said about asking, believing, and receiving. According to the books, The Secret and the Bible I think, the key that unlocks the door to The Secret is to receive the things we want and act as though we have already received them through our thinking. Our goals become real because the mind doesn't know the difference. Whatever we think will be. I think there is a lot of truth to the premise of affirmations and intentions.
One reason I started this thread is to understand what other people think about establishing goals, either spiritual or business. Goals and Objectives (G&O 's) have been a part of my business life, and I am trying to apply G&O's to my personal life, more. I stumble and fall a lot, but I have the desire to walk THE WAY. The following is from the website I referenced in the introduction to this thread.
If someone came up to you today and asked you what your next port of call is – that is, where you are going – could you answer him in one sentence, as could the captain on the bridge of their ship? If not, maybe you'd like to give that some thought.
A clinical Associate Professor of Psychiatry, Dr. Ari Kiev writes, "In my practice as a psychiatrist, I have found that helping people to develop personal goals has proven to be the most effective way to help them cope with problems. Observing the lives of people who have mastered adversity, I have noticed," he writes, "that they have established goals and sought with all their effort to achieve them. From the moment they decided to concentrate all their energies on a specific objective, they began to surmount the most difficult odds."
So writes Dr. Kiev in his book, A Strategy for Daily Living, "The establishment of a goal is the key to successful living. And the most important step toward achieving an objective is first to define it." I'm sure you have at least 30 minutes a day in which to list your thoughts about possible goals. Set aside such a period each day for a month. At the end of the time, choose from the possible objectives you have listed, the one that seems most important, and record it separately on a single card. Carry this card with you at all times. Think about this objective every day. Create concrete mental images of the goal, as if you've already accomplished it.
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Post by karmaxtrodinair on Jun 11, 2007 10:31:05 GMT -4
Again, very good of these writers and readers. I haven't read these self help books. I should. At least to get a prospective and probably a lot of help too. The Bible Ive read and had to re read and get a NIV to understand some of the things..
I will also admit that Ive read books of another's theory and prospective and had a hard time agreeing with them..
Ive been wrong too.. I didn't read the book The Purpose Driven Life entirely until my church started a study group using it.. and I was amazed at what that book held..
Ill give these theories that you mention attention because they seem to be working for you. Thanks for sharing.
As I said and will say, I am the most imperfect person probably on these boards. Lots of my life learning has been first hand.. and it ain't been flipping pages solely either.. Ive been wrong many of times.. many of many but thats what has given me confidence to turn to today for living the best I can.
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manape
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Post by manape on Jun 11, 2007 23:59:21 GMT -4
Karmax, I think you will do well in your business, because you seem to be likable. You said, "I am the most imperfect person probably on these boards." Thank God we don't have to be perfect.
Some people think of themselves as perfect, Superman, able to do anything in a single bound. But superheroes don't really exist, and real people need real help. In dealing with people at work or in our spiritual lives, it is best to let people know you understand this by asking for help and expressing appreciation.
I deal a lot with people on the phone. I'm trying to get better at it. I think the most important thing in business or life general is to be real and real likable. On a job, you get promoted, make sales, and get rewarded because people like you.
I wish I had discovered a long time ago, if you want to differentiate yourself at work or dealing with people is to focus on your personality. I guess it is never too late.
I think one mistake we have all made is not seeing people for who they are. If you treat people who are powerful well and people who have no power poorly then you aren't seeing the whole person. Treat everyone with respect or you won't deserve it yourself.
If you're not curious about other people, they won't be interested in you. The most likable people make other people feel interesting by genuinely caring about them.
If you think work matters more than people, then that'll be true --for you. And people will expect you to be a workhorse but won't want to get to know you. And they need to know you to like you.
If people don't like you, it's your own fault. Likable people are liked in all circumstances. If you blame people for your problems, people aren't going to like you -- even if they're not among the people you blame.
Another way to make yourself likable is to seek objective feedback. You can get it from therapists, co-workers, teachers, and coaches, but you have to seek it out. And if you don't, then you probably don't have a good sense of your least likable qualities. So you don't have the knowledge to make yourself likable.
All the knowledge in the world can't overcome an inability to change. The ego is very strong and can rationalize anything. Don't let yours do that. Take criticism to heart, and address it no matter how likable you think you are to begin with.
You'll be more likable right away, because listening to others and trying to change are both inherently likable qualities. (Source: Yahoo)
The Purpose
I studied "The Purpose" on my own. I still read parts of it. The group study sounds like a good idea. Perhaps, we could start one here.
What does your study group say about protecting the church (Chapter 21)? There are two Bible references given, as follows: Ephesians 4:3 says, "You are joined together with peace through the Spirit, so make every effort to continue together in this way.
"Most of all, let love guide your life, for then the whole church will stay together in perfect harmony." Colossi ans 3:14
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Post by karmaxtrodinair on Jun 12, 2007 1:37:26 GMT -4
True.. very true.. your words are indeed! I'm taking your advice to heart and hoping to be more likable. Yes, group study is a great and inspiring way.. I, myself am very interested in this. "Most of all, let love guide your life, for then the whole church will stay together in perfect harmony." Colossi ans 3:14 I believe in the church, I believe in my church. I also believe that if I would not let the thoughts that the kids will still be whinny and grouchy during church as they are in the morning when I am trying to get them all motivated.. and quit using excuses myself to lay out of church, and actually attend and hold stead fast in attendance, than that is when a church is at its best is when the MEMBERS JOIN IN AND PARTICIPATE. When folks put forth the effort to stand strong in faith.. and in their life.. all things become stronger.. A church is important.. its worship and joining together of love and spirit by Gods children.. to rejoice and praise.. he does deserve that too.. every bit in my humble opinion. I should not falter in the not joining with my family.. and the excuses are ridiculous that I always have myself.. anyone else do that or done that? Therefor, I do not myself, think that a whole church is to blame if one declines.. it is exactly what you say in your references of Colossi ans and Ephesians.. and they are perfect verses. Pray and ask God for wisdom if you are having difficulty finding the right church (James 1:5-8). I John (John's first letter, not his gospel) talks about signs of faith. One is that a true believer loves other Christians and wants to be with them (I John 3:13-16, 4:19-20). It is natural for us to want to be with God's people. (See also Acts 2:42-47.) If you love someone, you will also accept the people that they love. So it is with God. If we truly love God, we will love God's people. As always, thank you. You are likable.
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manape
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Post by manape on Jun 12, 2007 9:28:21 GMT -4
Chapter 21 (Protecting the Church) of the Purpose is a powerful chapter.
"Most of all, let love guide your life, for then the whole church will stay together in perfect harmony." Colossians 3:14
The verse above is a powerful verse. Despite our individual differences, imperfections, denominational-ism, and legalism of thousands of rules we cannot follow, The Body of Christ will stay together if we ALL let love guide our lives.
I'm not so concerned about showing up at a building at a predetermined time on Sunday, as I am about being the CHURCH daily. Fellowshipping with other Christians and being the church is what is important, not sitting in a pew and looking at the heads of faceless people. It is important for learning, if that is the way you learn. It sounds like you learned more from your small group study of The Purpose, than the big church.
The Bible says for us not to neglect the assembling of ourselves together, it doesn't talk about going to a building at a certain time. I could be wrong...can anyone show me chapter and verse?
Love is a binding force of being the church. That is the "Secret" of Being THE CHURCH, the Body of Christ. The Church is 24/7, not just Sunday and Wednesday at the theater we call "our church." It is only one gathering of the called out, the way, or the ekklesia. The Church is fellowship at the breakfast table, at the computer, at the Waffle House, even the Church House in small groups, the workplace, or where ever Christians are joined together.
GTG, but I will leave with this. We are all connected...let's work on being the church God wants to be.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us." Oliver Wendell Holmes
That's my take on Protecting The Church.
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Post by karmaxtrodinair on Jun 12, 2007 11:42:13 GMT -4
See Manape.. I didn't read into your question as church of the body.. and should because I quoted and responded to this part of your message above "What does your study group say about protecting the church (Chapter 21)? There are two Bible references given, as follows: Ephesians 4:3 says, "You are joined together with peace through the Spirit, so make every effort to continue together in this way." My reply in short was that the church joined together is strong! Did I read into it the wrong way? If So, I apologize. Now that I know more of your view on church.. I can say that ours has went through this as well and yes indeed.. we all agreed about being the church daily as well. It is something to strive harder for.. completely. I feel awesome when I go to church, whether my soul is condemned, I can feel the spirit of the Lord.. I WALK OUT FEELING RENEWED, I really can not explain WHY or HOW wonderful the feeling truly is.. but it makes me wonder AFTER the excuses of not attending, why I did not attend with my family and want to feel this feeling. I would never tell someone that they would go to hell if they did not attend church. I wouldn't.. the best RELATIONSHIP is between you and God.. and only you and him know the depths of that.. but certainly would not discourage spiritual uplifting of ones preference.. If it works for you.. than its working. 4Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.' "
Acts 20:32 (New International Version) New International Version (NIV) Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society
32"Now I commit you to God and to the word of his grace, which can build you up and give you an inheritance among all those who are sanctified.
This would be quotes of verses from Chapter 24
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manape
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Post by manape on Jun 12, 2007 13:02:37 GMT -4
The concept of the church is something I have struggled with for a while. I was raised Baptist, but I have come to recognize the church (Christians) as one church. It is fine to associate yourself with a local church. It seems to me we have gotten away from the true concept of the church.
The whole church is the body of Christ and that is the church I think we should protect (Chapter 21 of The Purpose). That's the way the world sees Christians. They recognize Christians as The Body of Christ and they watch our every move.
Many people are turned off by our buildings, legalism, and boring sermons. There is nothing inherently wrong with our churches, it is just not what some people are looking for...we must go to the people. Most churches have become businesses, lecture halls, and theaters.
Don't get me wrong...it is wonderful that you that people are happy and have found a place to worship in a church building. And I'm sure your pastor is a good man. I just think we should think of the church outside our little holy huddles.
I saw a sign at Liberty Baptist Church that said, "You can't hide from God by missing church." The sign should say, "You can't hide from God in a Building". ;D You can't miss church if we are the church.
There is only one body; not many bodies. There are many local gatherings. There local gatherings, like the church of Fellowship Baptist, the church of Baptist whatever, the church of The Methodist, the church of Presbyterians, Catholics, the church of you and me connected to the Internet, (and other Christians reading this forum), etc. We are all one body. We are all one church.
For me church is any place I choose to meet with other Christians. We don't go to church; we are the church.
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Post by karmaxtrodinair on Jun 12, 2007 14:59:27 GMT -4
Clarity is a good thing to have when you are souring through life's destination. If things are not clear, it makes it harder. Having goals and being on a path that works is much better than being on a dis functional path. I do not know many that like the dis functional path.
As for Liberty Church, I do love the people of that church. There are a lot of good ones that attend the church and have shown me alot.
I do not know who does the signs but I do read ALL of the church signs.. specially when they grab my attention and reach out.
Like the Bible, people (myself for one) can sure enough read into it for how it suits a situation in multiple ways... to fit circumstances.. but clarity comes.. I have lots of things I have yet to learn and do not understand. I can not say that the list of unclear information outweighs the clear.. cause in time, things become clear.
I will not knock anyone not going to church, I speak for myself when I say I feel better when I go to church and it is uplifting.. that I see the strength where two or more are gathered. I do not speak on behalf of everyone else's journey with faith.. or destination. Everyone has a purpose.. everyone.
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manape
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Post by manape on Jun 12, 2007 18:06:04 GMT -4
Defending the Church, Chapter 21, The Purpose
I've gone to many churches and I don't feel the need to join any particular one.
I would like to hear some feedback on how we could improve the whole church. I'm not sure mega-church services are a very efficient way to reach people who need to hear the Gospel. They don't usually go to church.
How do other people see the church?
Have you noticed people go to a church one time and disappear because they don't find what they need or want? I notice because I am one of those people who disappear.
I really don't care to get into naming churches, defending individual churches, or denominations. That's like the left hand saying I am better than the right hand when they are both part of the body.
Even if there were a perfect church, it would be ruined because I joined. That's what you have to put up with if you are a hairy, smelly, 8-foot tall manape. ;D
Instead of going to church, how do we reach out to people? We have million dollar churches and the people go hungry down the street. They are hungry for THE WORD.
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